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Bevo's Daily Roundup - November 19, 2009

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Colt McCoy has a lot of people who thought he couldn't hack it at UT. And those were his friends.

Colt McCoy left the tiny town of Tuscola with dreams of being Texas' next great quarterback. Lingering below the self-confidence were words that stung his heart.

Too small. Too slow. Weak arm.

Those were his friends saying that.

Great small-town player, they said, but Texas and the Big 12 were places for the big boys, not a player from the lower divisions of high school.

"I had people in my town, friends of mine, people real close to me saying that I would never be able to play here," McCoy said. "They see a guy like Vince Young or Ryan Perrilloux. Everybody thought I was awesome in high school but that's just from our town.

"I definitely used that as motivation," McCoy said. "I still do to this day."

ESPN's Richard Durrett profiles Chris Hall. Did you know he is an ordained minister?

Mark Mangino on the Longhorns:

"Texas is an outstanding team, an excellent football team. No weaknesses on the offensive side of the ball. They feature a great quarterback in Colt McCoy. He can beat you throwing and he can beat you with his feet. Their defense gives you looks, moves around, they have a really impressive defensive line, outstanding linebackers that run sideline to sideline and really an excellent secondary that plays the ball well and also tackles well. It’s a challenge to go down to Austin, but we’re looking forward to going down there and playing very well."

 

Basketball

Rick likes the smart ones. Of all the freshmen that played against UC-Irvine, Shawn Williams was the most impressive.

Shawn Williams didn't have a star-in-the-making moment like other Longhorns freshmen did in their debuts Sunday.

He didn't swoop in for a blocked shot or make a slashing drive for a basket like Jordan Hamilton. He didn't convert two steals into fast-break dunks like Avery Bradley. He didn't make three three-point baskets like J'Covan Brown.

But the 6-foot-6-inch Williams impressed Texas coach Rick Barnes nevertheless in the season-opener against UC Irvine.

"I thought Shawn Williams did the best job of taking care of the details out of all the young guys," Barnes said. "He's a very cerebral player."

One of the challenges this season is managing the depth of talent.

"We talk about flow. How do we maintain the flow?" Barnes said. "We’ve got a group of guys who understand what we need to do, and when we go to the bench, it’s up to the guys who come into the game to maintain that flow."

 

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Does Mike Sherman think his defense has improved?

His answer: sometimes.

"There were times in that [Oklahoma] game, watching it and then watching the tape, where we're wrapping guys up, we're more physical, we're reacting quicker," Sherman said. "We'll have two good plays and then we'll give up a big play.

"So do I see at times us playing great defense? Yeah, there are times I do see that. There's also times I see us not. The consistency is more what is lacking."

 

What to do? The Aggies have quite a dilemma. Do they wear pink to the Baylor game and support breast cancer research or not? Opinion is running rampant on Texags.

 

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When asked if Oklahoma was his last coaching stop, Stoops replied:

“Oh, who knows? I’m not that old, I guess. I haven’t reached 50 yet. So, who knows what’s in store, you know?”

A certain Oklahoma City sports writer is worried about the Aggies.

Only one top-shelf school seems prone to losing its coach to another school. Alabama lost Bill Curry to Kentucky in 1989, though Bama was trying to kick him out the door, and then lost Dennis Franchione to Texas A&M in 2003, when it most certainly didn’t want to lose Fran.

A&M can be sneaky. The Aggies got Franchione from Alabama, Jackie Sherrill from Pitt in 1982 and Bear Bryant from Kentucky in 1953.

A&M, that’s who schools like Oklahoma ought to worry about. Not Notre Dame.

Mike Leach to Louisville? Dennis Dodd is thinking the same thing.

The latest from the coaching rumor mill is that there is a mutual interest between Texas Tech coach Mike Leach and Louisville.

It is almost a certainty that Cardinals’ coach Steve Kragthorpe will be relieved of his duties after this, his third season. Louisville is 4-6 with games left against South Florida and Rutgers. It needs to win those to have a chance to go bowling for the first time since 2006. Kragthorpe is 15-19 at Louisville.

Tim Griffin thinks Mark Mangino's old-school ways have gotten him in trouble.

Mangino is a good coach. But his story is a cautionary tale for all in his profession.

In today’s world, coaches can’t berate players like they used to. Physical contact is an absolute no-no.

Mangino appears to have trouble adapting to those societal changes. His career is in serious jeopardy because of it.

Another sports writer thinks it is all about the record.

If Kansas fires football coach Mark Mangino, it will be about one thing: he’s losing. The stuff you’re hearing about Mangino now — he has a foul temper, he bullies his players, he has a history of throwing tantrums after receiving parking tickets on the campus — were all true when he led KU to a 12-1 record two years ago. It was the best season in Kansas history, and I don’t recall any talk about Mangino’s hot-headed manners, or how shabbily he treated others. But Mangino has lost 5 games in a row, and and the Jayhawks are at the bottom (1-5) of the Big 12 North standings, and they play at Texas on Saturday, which means another massacre is coming.

The Sooners are leaders in sickle-cell testing.

One of the biggest issues in dealing with players who have sickle cell is that a sickling episode may look like it’s heat-related, especially since intense and prolonged physical activity can cause them. Knowing that a player has the sickle cell trait is the best way to avoid a problem.

Both Oklahoma and Oklahoma State test for sickle cell.

Earlier this year, the NCAA recommended schools test for sickle cell, but it stopped short of making the testing mandatory.

  Ndamukong Suh doesn't like that cutesy stuff.

It’s certain Suh is excited to take on a Kansas State offense that likes to play smash-mouth football.

“They definitely want to come downhill on you, which is great for me,” Suh said. “That’s my type of football, not the cutesy stuff that we see the majority (of the time) in our conference with the spread offenses.”

 

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Gary Patterson lives in a fantasy world.

Upon further review, even after TCU's demolition of Utah barely registered on the BCS' Richter scale, Gary Patterson remains resolute.

With no more chances left to impress, he's still content just to be in the conversation.

Still happy with the system.

Still buying the fantasy.

"If we can win two more," he said Tuesday, "and somebody were to slip up ..."

Hey, Gary. Wake up, pal. It's not just one "somebody" you need help with. It's two.

Either Florida or Alabama will slip up, but not both.

And that still leaves Texas, which isn't likely to lose to Kansas, Texas A&M or whatever the Big 12 North offers as a sacrifice.

The BCS does not do refunds. Ivan Maisel wants his money back.

I want my money back.

It is the third week in November -- the traditional beginning of rivalry season -- and the best game is No. 11 Oregon at unranked Arizona.

The National Championship Issue looks at the relationship between the BCS and money.

The reality is that there are some teams that have more fans and bring in money no matter what they're doing on the field, and some teams that could win big every year but still not see many fans (respectively). Two good examples are South Carolina and Boise State. Between 2002-2008, the Gamecocks were 44-41, going 8-5 in their best season; the Broncos were 70-8, going 9-4 in their worst season. But in terms of attendance, South Carolina averaged 80,000 per game while Boise State averaged just 30,000 per game. Quite the difference.

So who you think bowl executives would rather have playing in their game?

0 recs  |  127 comments

Comments

Everytime I read something on TexAgs

the cliche sitcom laugh track plays in my head.

I get the "Benny Hill" music. nt
Why are teams wearing pink?

Seriously, there are much more prevalent and dangerous forms of cancer than breast cancer. Why don’t football teams do something in support of prostate cancer, which has a higher rate of incidence and mortality than breast cancer?

Obviously I think breast cancer is an important issue, but seriously, it gets an extremely disproportionate level of attention. NFL and college teams have public campaigns for it, people throw money at it, clothing lines and car magnets glamorize its movement, fundraising is peand it gets almost twice as much federal research funding as prostate cancer does, despite its lower rates of incidence and mortality.

I propose the Longhorns wear light blue, for prostate cancer awareness.

Because it affects our mothers, our sisters and our daughters

What about our fathers, brothers, and sons?

We dont care about them as much, generally speaking.

Didn't Cosby to a bit about that?

He recalls all the time he spent with his son playing football. Remembers all the fatherly coaching and time spent together. Then his son scores his first touchdown in a televised game and says, ‘Hi Mom!’ to the cameras.

Ask his mom...

All those hours of painful labor far outweigh any time dad spent throwing the ball around. :-)

If you have children go home and thank your wife for those long, protracted hours. Or send flowers.

Done forget about all of the future problems as a result of childbirth.

My wife has a hysterectomy this morning and she is in pain (she waiting for the morphine to kick in…broken pump). And while I my typing this she is worried about what the kids and I are going to eat in the morning (this after she bought groceries Tuesday night). Gota love our women.

This wasn’t meant as a discussion on cancer, but on the stupidity of a bunch of Aggies trying to decide to wear pink.

But to breast cancer… (Actually lung cancer still kills more people than all other cancers.) The reason that it gets so much play is because women like Nancy Brinker were able to get the message out and do a great job publicizing the cause. Why she did this is here. Brinker started this crusade because doctors did a lousy job with patients and diagnosis years ago. Because of women like Brinker, a lot has changed. Early detection is key and that is really what the pr campaign is about. (Now the powers that be want women in their 40s to forego mammograms. Brilliant.) I won’t go into my feelings on women’s health care issues and how they are treated nationally because this isn’t the right forum. But speaking as a women, we have been on the short end of the stick for years.

It just seems that men have been less likely to talk openly about prostrate cancer. Women have just been better at publicizing the issue.

I’m off my soapbox today.

The 40+ mammography issue

I know it’s not the venue to go into this in depth, but the ACS spokesperson noted on NPR yesterday that the 40-49 mammography practice has had virtually no impact, and stated that the aggregate cost would be much more useful for research.

Tell that to my two friends in that age range that were diagnosed with breast cancer from their annual mammogram.

No need to take it personally

If we’re going to take this to a personal level and get into anecdotal evidence, I could as easily say that the “better publicity” angle is something you ought to tell to my grandfather, who died of prostate cancer.

There’s a difference between anecdotal and empirical evidence, as I’m sure you know.

Putting an actuarial value on human life may warm John Stuart Mill's no longer beating heart

but policy decisions based on B < PL and the Coase Theorem tend to break down rapidly when agonizing deaths are at issue for a sizable portion of the population.

People are funny that way.

Again

Numbers. I’m no utilitarianist, but the numbers as far as how many agonizing deaths there are actually favor increased funding of prostate and lung cancer research over breast cancer.

There is no better, worse form of cancer, who dies more, etc. My point was that it is important for everyone to be aware and women have done a better job at pr. Don’t blame us: We worked the system better. I suggest you use all this energy to get out there and do something about publicizing prostrate cancer. Raise money and awareness. Contact UT and ask them to consider doing something at a game.

Enough of this. Back to Suh’s stupid comment about cutesy football…

"don't blame us, we worked the system better"

Is the defense for many haves who have disenfranchised the havenots over the years, including men who disenfranchised women. I’m not sure I’d want to be associated with that defense.

I thought I read the ACS was against this report...

The article I read had the ACS saying that 1 in 5 cases of breast cancer is detected before the age of 50 and the suggestion that mammograms were unnecessary or not optimal for women in their 40s was an incorrect and dangerous assertion.

and my sister-in-law

who died of it in her 30s. cancer was already stage IIIb when it was found. survivor rates are much higher the earlier it is found. my wife and i miss her terribly.

My condolences

However, as the report pointed out, there has been zero measurable improvement in survival rate for those screened ages 40-49. Over 50, there’s a 15% improvement, which is why it’s so important, but under 50, there’s no improvement. Of course, any woman with risk factors should definitely start screening early and often, IMO, just like I (as the descendant of a man who had prostate cancer) started my prostate cancer screenings (I call it “insured ball-jiggling time”) at age 30—just a few months ago, in fact.

For the record, I got the point of it

It’s always fun to watch Texags having another think-tank moment.

Better PR.

Also, men account for about 5% of cases.

That's my point

Better PR seems to be the main reason. I think it’s very unfortunate how disproportionate the attention is.

I think its unfortunate to knock breast cancer awareness movement for doing a good job

When you should be knocking prostate, lung, or whatever cancer awareness movement you support for falling behind.

The problem with prostate cancer is you can’t make awesome billboards/shirts/comercials and get it aired without a N/S tag. Have you seen those advertisements with the cleavage hanging out? I don’t know what else the ad said. All i know is that there was a big set of boobs and a pink ribbon.

Can’t do that with balls.

This is the best example I could find

Im not marketing agent

But I do know that boobs can be made to sell any product, idea, or cause.

For instance:

Paging sexual harrassment panda...
You rang?

Sad story

He went to the island of misfit mascots, where he met up with Pistol Pete and Willie the Wildcat.

First I want to take a moment to appreciate BiC's tremendous MS paint skills

And second, now that Panda is here, it can make me aware of all of the pick up lines I’m not allowed to use on women wearing that shirt.

Such as?

I mean, you could type them here, and technically you wouldn’t be using them on women wearing that shirt.

That shirt is very becoming on you...

Of course, if I were on you, I’d be coming, too.

But, I’m speaking for learned hand. That certainly didn’t come from me ;)

And RIGHT after I hit post, I realized, I probably shouldn’t have. feel free to delete, and apologies ahead of time for anyone offended.

When in doubt . . .

. . . just ask yourself, WWSHPD?

The problem is the movement

As an example, I stated that prostate cancer should be a bigger concern than breast cancer because it affects and kills more people. That is a sentiment that is not well-received, as even this thread shows, despite the fact that it is true. But for some reason breast cancer has become inextricably linked with feminism. I support both feminism and breast cancer awareness movements, but I think questioning the primacy of breast cancer among diseases should not be equated with anti-feminism, as so often happens.

But prostate cancer generally affects an even older population than breast cancer...

Something like 60% of the diagnoses and 80% of deaths from prostate cancer happen to men age 70 and older. In fact only a half a percent (0.5%) of cases are diagnosed to men between the ages of 35 and 44. With another 8% occurring in the next ten year period (45-54). So men below 50 are much less likely (less than 9%) to get prostate cancer than are women under the age of 50 (somewhere around 20% of cases). While men are more likely to get prostate cancer in their lifetime (16-17%) than women are to get breast cancer (12%) the survival rates are actually higher for prostate cancer (27,000 men will likely die of prostate cancer this year compared with 47,000 women who will die from breast cancer) and the median age for a diagnosis is much later in a man’s life.

Found this data at these sites:
http://www.prostatecancerfoundation.org
http://prostate-cancer.emedtv.com/prostate-cancer/
http://www.cancer.org

All cancer is a tragedy no matter the form it takes. Lung cancer is still the biggest killer of all forms of cancer for both men and women. It is also the most preventable. The ACS did a great job of lower levels of smoking over the past several decades, but they need to raise the level of awareness again since it seems smoking is on the rise amongst young people in the country.

This argument is awesome...

and I may betray my ignorance here, but isn’t breast cancer also one of the forms of cancer that is least associated with lifestyle decisions? In other words, victims of breast cancer have no control over contracting the disease.

As far as I know, the same is true of prostate cancer.

Yep, which is why I didn't bother making a case for lung cancer

which has very strong behavioural risk factors.

True...

I suppose testicular cancer as well. But many of the most prevalent forms of cancer (lung, colon, and skin) seem to be more preventable.

Does focusing on breast cancer increase funding which helps research for other types of cancer?

I agree with burntorangehorn’s arguments and I too have been disappointed in the past with the disproportionate attention to breast cancer over other forms of cancer.

But watching all of the pink being worn at NFL games that first weekend in October and after getting pretty steamed about what appeared to be a cynical PR move (buy all of your favorite team gear, but in pink this time!) wrapped in the cloak of a worthwhile cause, the thought occurred to me that maybe the disproportionate focus on finding a cure for breast cancer is a wise move for funding research into a cure for all forms of cancer. Perhaps decades of fundraising have demonstrated that donations for cancer research increase sharply when the focus is on this particular form of cancer rather than into cancer in general.

And I’m just going to make a crazy guess here given that I am among the scientifically illiterate, but wouldn’t breakthroughs which led to curing/eliminating breast cancer also be applicable towards curing/eliminating other forms of cancer? Is breast cancer really that much different from prostate cancer that a cure for one wouldn’t lead to a cure, or at least significant progress to a cure, for the other?

If that’s what it’s really about — a focus on breast cancer in particular leads to increases in funding research into cure which would apply to all forms of cancer — then I’m OK with the focus on breast cancer in general. But if not, then I would continue to agree with all of the objections raised by burntorangehorn.

Also,

I would think the morale boost in the scientific community and the general public to point to any form of cancer and say “hey, we beat this!” would be tremendous. Even if that particular cure was “unique” the confidence would probably lead to more funding from people who believed that we were “realistically” close to beating all forms of cancer.

/liberal arts major with no scientific knowledge, but a tiny bit of experience fund raising.

Suh and the cutesy stuff

Now I actually WANT Nebraska to win the north. Let’s see how cutesy he thinks it is when it puts five touchdowns on his defense.

I guess Cody Johnson will have to rumble on by...

…withOUT batting an eyelash.

Maybe Jordan Shipley could score a couple of coquettish touchdowns?

One of those cutesy offenses put 31 points on Suh and the Nebraska defense. I bet it wasn’t too lovely watching game films the next week.

Exactly

And I wish we could go with a jumbo package the entire first quarter running right at Suh until he can’t get his “cutesy” off the turf.

Seriously he sounds frustrated with the spread. Tech rattled him because the QB’s got rid of the ball before he could get off his man. We need to run his butt ragged.

Dan Patrick

Did anyone hear Dan Patrick grill the BCS boss on his radio show yesterday? He had no answers on why the BCS was better than a playoff. Not a great showing during his first interview on the job. Also, calling all aggies against wearing pink for Breast Cancer….F U.

He's an OU grad....

what did you expect?

well then...

that IS the reason the BCS is better… nobody has benefited more from the BCS than OU.

I was referreing to the fact

that he couldnt come up with an answer. Takes a REAL education to do that.

My 2 cents

Leach to leave Tech? I just don’t see it, especially after this past season’s tirade about his extension. Granted he won’t owe the school any money if he leaves, but it would surpise me if he left. On the other hand, maybe he finally realized that he will always be 2nd or 3rd fiddle in the South.

If he left, I could see this opening the door for Baylor to climb up the pecking order of the South’s ladder. Also, could this open the door for the pendulum to swing back in favor of the North?!!? Just sayin’…..

As for Mangino and KU – who does KU think they could get?!? Basketball is king at KU and Mangino was cautiously vocal about no love for football. Does a new coach think it would change?!

Sorry KU, just because he brought some respectability to the program, your one Orange Bowl season doesn’t mean much to anyone outside Lawrence. Iowa State is happy with Rhoads and that he has them back to McCarney’s level of success – which leads me to say “so you fired McCarney why then?!?!” ……we’ll be asking Kansas the same thing, “what was the point of firing Mangino then?”

My 2 cents

I think Leach and Mangino are in similar situations, but Leach has had more sustained success and has gotten opportunities to look elsewhere. I think both hate their ADs and their ADs hate them. Leach at least has an AD that has to give his program the most love since Knight’s son hasn’t shown any ability to make B-ball a mainstay for fans (not that his dad did either). Leach has options since he has proven his success for many years. He might want to bail just to get away from Gerald Myers and he can if he is willing to make a lateral/slightly downward move. It is apparent he is unlikely to ever get the call from a big time program, but if he can do for Louisville what he did for Tech, the grass may indeed be greener for him up in Kentucky even if it means rebuilding a program from scratch.

Mangino is in a worse situation with a new AD who wants to push a national championship winning basketball program and doesn’t want the football coach to complain about how resources are allocated. I am sure Perkins doesn’t want a a losing football program, but he probably feels he can get a decent football program without the headaches of dealing with a hot head like Mangino. I have heard UConn’s coach is high on his list. I am sure Edsall doesn’t complain about his football program playing second fiddle to their national powerhouse basketball program. He might like the opportunity to step up to a more powerful conference but not have any greater expectations than he does now about maintaining a high-level of success. Perkins can also pull in another up-in-comer who will owe his promotion to Perkins and his regime and not be as likely to complain about resources. I am not saying this will work out for KU, but its not hard to see what Perkins might want and its even easier to see how a lot of coaches could jump at the chance to take over. Other than attrition of top talent at a lot of their skills positions, Mangino’s ouster doesn’t leave their cupboard completely bare and another coach could come in and still hope for a bowl game next year.

The Big XII would be a lot less fun without Leach

I understand why he would want to go to a more attractive place with more upside, but let’s face it, he can be hilarious

The poor guy just wants out of Lubbock. Can anyone blame him?

Have you been to Norman?

I’ve driven through it. They are both a toss-up for lousy places to live. In fact, the entire state of Oklahoma is a lousy place to live.

Leach lived in Norman and he wanted to go to Lubbock… What was he thinking.

To quote Elaine Benes:

“It’s like moving from Iceland to Finland.”

"Fat Girlfriends"?
Freddie Mercury knew what makes the world go 'round
Hey stop picking on people's appearances or thanos might come down on you! n/t
shhhh.......

I don’t think he’s listening.

No?

Fattie fattie fattie!!!!!

I can see Leach.....

…. bolting for Louisville. If he does, then he’ll have them winning in short order. He’s been dabbling in Florida recruiting at the skill positions and has been having some recent success. Put him in Louisville and he’ll have a pipeline to those players being passed by Florida and Georgia. His offense will be more appealing than Miami, Florida State and others.

If Leach does leave, then Myers would be smart to jump on Kevin Sumlin. He has the perfect system to take advantage of the TT players. He can recruit like crazy and with some real money for a staff, he could do some good. He knows coaching talent.

I’d be really surprised to see Perkins successful in luring away Edsall. I’m thinking Edsall has eyes from something more appealing than Lawrence, Kansas. If Perkins moves on Mangino I’m thinking Perkins will look back wondering what the heck he was thinking! It could take 3 or 5 tries to find another coach who can make that work. Especially with Bill Snyder back at KSU.

Lawrence is a nice place

It’s sort of Austin-lite, actually. I really like it there.

Think....

…. transportation and recruiting. Not easy, nor inexpensive.

I had never thought of that angle until an article came out about how excited Bill Snyder was about a direct American Eagle flight to Manhattan. It was in the Roundup a week or so ago.

That's true.

Lawrence doesn’t have its own big airport. However, it does have a very nice large-sized airport less than an hour away (Kansas City Int’l), and a small domestic airport just half an hour away (Topeka). Topeka has decent service, and KC is a larger airport in terms of passenger volume and aircraft operations than Austin-Bergstrom.

Think.....

….. about quality players making summer camps. Especially if they are inner city guys without a car or discretionary cash.

Lawrence would be a step up for both over Storrs, CT...nt
I think Leach might actually help himself by rebuilding somewhere else...

If he is ever going to get a real cherry of a job, I think he has to replicate his success somewhere else. Louisville wouldn’t be a bad place to give it a go since the Big East could be ripe for the picking if he can get some of the Southeastern talent to run his system.

Tech will have a much better chance of getting a good replacement than KU. I think Sumlin might be looking for something more appealing than Lubbock and he will be in greater demand than Edsall.

I don’t think Perkins will ever look back on firing Mangino. If KU basketball continues to dominate and the football team gets to a bowl game every couple of years he will have a secure tenure in Lawrence. The more I read about Mangino, the more I get the sense that he was inevitably going to wear out his welcome. Now former players are calling him out and I am sure it can’t help recruiting. If his behavior precedes him the problems will also effect the coaching staff both in retention and in bringing in quality new blood. Perkins will have much more a crap shoot than Myers will have when it comes to a replacement, but if he gets lucky he won’t regret his decision for one minute. If he gets Dan Hawkins then he better hope Bill Self wins another couple of NCAA titles!

Leach would also have a much better shot at making a BCS game. He had his best year ever last year, only lost one game, and still got sqeezed out of the South title by the traditional powers UT and OU. In a bit of Irony, if Leach sticks around and ever does win the south, it will probably be the year that Nebraska makes a true combeback, and he would miss out on a BCS game due to losing to them in the title game.

He wouldn’t have any real traditional powerhouses to compete with. They have some very good teams, but its not like they have 3 teams that account for 12 or 15 (or whatever the number is) national titles (OU, UT, NU).

I would miss him if he left. It would be the Big 12’s loss.

and the football team gets to a bowl game every couple of years

Easier said than done. Mangino was the first to take it back to back and isn’t far from being KU’s winningest football coach. He’s already won more bowls (3) than any other coach has.

Having said all that…

Tech will have a much better chance of getting a good replacement than KU.

TT is good because of Leach’s system. Apart from his air raid offense TT wouldn’t be able to compete with the Big XII south powers at all. Even with it they’re not winning the south. KU can win the north. NU is on it’s way back up and KSU might be too, but it’s still way easier to win the north than the south.

TT has a long bowl history...

Tech has had success with other guys. I imagine Myers isn’t going to try and replace Leach with Paul Johnson or Gary Patterson. He is going to go after guys like Sumlin who run a similar offense. I imagine he will have his pick of guys at non-BCS schools running some similar version of Leach’s offense.

Mangino is ultimately a success due to circumstances. He doesn’t take Kansas to a bowl game if he is their coach in the 90’s. He wouldn’t have been competitive in the later years of the Big 8 and I doubt he would have had much success winning a lot of North Division games in the early years of the Big 12 with NU, KSU, Colorado and Iowa State turning out quality teams every year. Take out the anomaly of the 12-1 year and he has never won more than 3 conference games in a season and this coincides with a fortuitous period when NU, Colorado, KSU, and Iowa State are all down. He has been pathetic against the South division. Take out the 12-1 season and he has exactly one victory (over Baylor) against the South Division. I am not saying he hasn’t done a good job, he has considering the resources, but I don’t think replacing him with someone who can mount a 6-6 or 7-5 campaign every couple of years is necessarily going to be an impossible task.

I wouldn't want to be an AD trying to replace either coach.

I don’t think either team has a great chance of improving their lot in the Big 12 any time soon.

And you can’t take out the 12-1 season, it happened. KU won a BCS bowl which only UT, NU and OU had done from the Big 12. I know you’re saying it’s an anomaly, but it was still Mangino and KU’s anomaly. KU isn’t so good that they can expect to go 12-1 or even 10-3 regularly when they play the big boys of the south, but A&M and OSU did get beat by KU and go bowling in ’07.

Mangino is ultimately a success due to circumstances.

The same thing can be said (to a lesser degree) about UF, who hasn’t gone undefeated in either MNC season the last few years and also LSU in ’07 when they had 2 losses. Only undefeated champs can say otherwise.

He wouldn’t have been competitive in the later years of the Big 8 and I doubt he would have had much success winning a lot of North Division games in the early years of the Big 12 with NU, KSU, Colorado and Iowa State turning out quality teams every year.

I think he’d have done better than Allen. And I don’t think ISU belongs in that list if you’re talking early years of the Big 12 rather than early 2000s.

I think KU should feel like its worth the risk...Tech may not have a choice if Leach leaves.

I am not sure either team should have expectations of improving their lot even with their current coaches in place. I don’t see that either team has any real upside beyond where they are. KU at least has a chance to remove a cancer from their athletic program and with the extended schedule and with more bowl games the ability to get to the postseason is much easier than it was even a decade ago. So they may never get another BCS bowl bid, but I am sure Perkins would be happy if the program at least makes regular appearances in the postseason.

There is a big difference between KU’s 12-1 season and UF or LSU winning the national title without going undefeated. KU’s 12-1 season was pretty unanimously agreed as a bit of a mirage. But if you are going put undefeated teams from weak conferences like the MWC and WAC in the BCS you can’t really leave out a 12-1 team from the Big 12 even if they played the weakest slate possible (that 2007 sched was a murderer’s row compared to Boise State’s slate this year). UF and LSU beat multiple ranked teams on their paths to their titles and both teams have won 2…KU has that 12-1 season and then what?

I won’t disagree that Mangino was a step up from his predecessor, but I also think if he is replaced the new guy will have a much better starting position not only because Mangino wouldn’t have left the cupboard bare but also because the North is still incredibly weak and there are enough potential wins on the schedule to do better than the 5-7 this team is likely to put up this year. Its apparent that Mangino is a cancer and even if this stuff didn’t get out to the media, his actions and this season’s complete collapse suggest that he is leading a sinking vessel that he in large part scuttled on his own.

Also, from Parlin's comment on BC:
Mangino’s had more wins (25) in his last three seasons than 32 KU coaches have had in their entire careers.
Take out the 12-1 season and the numbers look at lot like those other 32 coaches...

Plus Mangino gets 1, 2, 3, 4 more games than his predecessors depending on how far back you go. 2 of Mangino’s bowl teams got invites with only 6 wins. Glen Mason went 6-5 twice but didn’t bowl invites for those seasons, in fact Mangino is the Kansas coach to get a bowl invite by winning only 6 games.

Take out the 13-0 2005.....

…. season and how much hardware has Mack put in the trophy case?

You don’t get to selectively remove a season from a HC’s record. He put together a great season with all of 6(SIX) 4-star recruits in the 5 classes prior to the season’s start. In those same 5 classes, MB had 55 4-star recruits and 6 5-star recruits. Let that sink in for awhile.

What went wrong with Steve Kragthorpe at Louisville?
Krag1N1

It actually started in Louisville, then sped across the globe…killing at will.

Lot of stuff here DC

Let’s talk Stoops. Isn’t it funny that he goes from calling the notion of the Notre Dame job “ridiculous” one day and then comes out with an “I don’t know” response today regarding his tenure at ou?

sounds familiar

No coach will ever fully admit to any interest until it’s in writing. Remember Urban Meyer leaving Bowling Green:

“We are nowhere near what we can do here. That’s what’s driving me right now,” Meyer said Tuesday afternoon. "Everybody’s worried about those other places; nothing’s going on.

“I was contacted by one, but I’m not interested. I love it here. We have a lot of work to do. That’s the bottom line.”

Meyer said the talk of his leaving started when he took the Bowling Green job. Coaches from other schools tell recruits Meyer is not going to stay with the Falcons.

“With recruits, that’s been for two years, even before we won,” he said. "[They say] ‘That guy’s not going to be there very long’; that’s silly … The future is fantastic here … I’m proud to be the football coach here.

“Once they get to know me, know my family, know how important it is to have continuity, my kids going to school somewhere.”

On Dec. 12, 2002, Meyer was hired as the new coach at Utah (34). Less than two years after that, he was off to that little fixer-upper at Florida.

Sorry, it’s from Forde.

Some even....

Go from non-admission to outright denial.

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